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Tuesday, February 18, 2014

AG Identifications: Historical Underwear

Insert "Panty shot" jokes here, with Cécile.
Hey, so as of tomorrow I will have been AG blogging for a year. Not bad work for a year. Let's keep going.

So a discussion came up on the AG Collectors board1 about the historical underwear--basically, if Addy and Caroline had the same underwear. And they do and don't. From that I decided that it would behoove us to have an ID post showing the slight--and the not so slight, in some major cases--differences among the historical panties, bloomers, and undergarments that the historicals came with. And so snapped pictures as I was changing everyone around. That way if your girl comes without her panties, you can--if you so choose--seek out her drawers and bloomers and cover her ass, as the case may be.

A little history before we start looking up skirts and down pants. Most of the historicals have white underwear. To modern eyes, white underwear might not seem to make sense, because white is traditionally harder to keep clean and shows dirt fast. But here's the sitch, Mitch: white can be sun bleached. As in laid out in the sun and allowed to fade. And in the days before Clorox2 this was was the best way to get out major staining without scrubbing the entire hell out of clothes. Other colors will and do fade (which is why old clothes can often look really pale, when they likely had vibrant bright colors.) So underwear were white because you wore those often and maybe had one or two sets (one to wear while the other got washed) and you had to get those stains out with vigorous abuse of the cloth. Sure they might get dingy and faded, but honestly no one was looking at your underwear most of the time anyways. Also, why would you waste expensive dyes on underwear? Again, no one was looking at your underwear.

Furthermore, the girls between the invention of pantaloons and the later shift to bloomers--from Caroline to Addy--have sealed drawers. That is, not split crotch. Split crotch drawers weren't wide open, but there was an opening front to back so that when you squatted down to attend to nature's call, you didn't have to pull down your pantaloons. Like elastic instead of tie strings, we're letting it go. I could go into historical underwear all day, but that's for review posts.

Listed in Reverse Historical--starting with Julie and going back to Kaya. Note that the petticoat Cécile is wearing under her meet dress isn't one that's made by AG. I have a Laylie3 who got out of all that frilly historical stuff and Cécile now wears her petticoat as ruffly cute under her dresses.

Julie's panties, as seen on Otters.
Julie, Classic: Julie has "modern" style underwear, as was discussed in the review post; smooth pink brief style panties with elastic waist and legs and a decorative butterfly on the front. Ivy has the same style, except they're yellow with a rainbow. I keep them on Kimmy. So far Julie and Ivy are the only one with colored panties.

Julie's panties, again on Otters.
Julie, BeForever: (Added 9/7/15) Julie's panties switch to a deep purple color, with no more designs on them. Other than that, there's no change; elastic waist and edging.

Maryellen. Yes, I'm that weirdo.
Maryellen, Melody: (Added 9/7/15, edited 10/3/16) Maryellen--ETA--and Melody--have plain, white panties with elastic edging and elastic waistband. Simple and clean. I snapped these in the store for everyone to see here. Don't say I don't try to be weird for you. 

Kit in what are probably Samantha's drawers. PC version.
Molly, Emily, Samantha (Classic), and Nellie: Molly, Samantha and their besties all share the same style of underwear. Yeah it's that kind of party. They all come with puffy white bloomer style panties that are stretch gathered at the waist and around each leg. They can be pulled down to mid-thigh for a less poofed look, or tucked right up against the hip joint to really get bloomer puff.

Kit's actual panties, from a downloaded guide.
Kit (Classic and BeForever), Ruthie: Kit's and Ruthie's bloomers have no ruffle edge at the hip and are just elastic-casing edged. My Kit does not have them--or if she does, they're in my shuffle of clothes and I'm not in the mood to hunt them down. ETA, 9/7/15: My Kit now has them, as her BeForever bloomers. 

Nellie has on Rebecca's panties. Mattel version.
Rebecca's (Classic and BeForever), Samantha (BeForever): Rebecca's have the same style of white and poofy, but have a a casing style elastic waist as opposed to sewn edged elastic. Research shows that I put these on Tara when she was displaying Samantha's Cranberry Dress.4 Ah well.

There's no change for BeForever for Rebecca, but she now shares the same style with Samantha.

Addy's Drawers, Classic.
Addy, Classic: Addy Classic Style has knee length white drawers--so called because you drew them on. This is a word that carried forward ever since. I still know older people who call em "draws." Hell, I do sometimes. Addy's drawers are semi-straight legged, have a v-front panel that is gathered to the front, elastic at the back, and at the trimmed hem edge there is eyelet and then scalloped lace style trim with a eyelet edge.

Addy's Drawers, BeForever style.
Addy, BeForever (Added 2/22/15): Addy's BeForever drawers are still knee-length and semi-straight legged. They now have no panel at all, with an elastic case waistband and at the hem have eyelet trim in five-floral shapes and a scalloped edge. 

I don't have Kirsten, but I have an image of her drawers.
Kirsten: Kirsten's drawers have no front panel, are elastic all the way around the waist band, and have scalloped eyelet trim at the edge with a one-dot three-dot pattern.

Cécile's Fancy Pantaloons.
Cécile: Cécile's pantaloons have no panel and are elastic all the way around the waist. They have oval up-and down eyelet lace trim with a scalloped edge, more like lace than trims.

Marie-Grace's pantaloons.
Marie-Grace: Like Cécile's, they have no panel and are elastic all the way around the waist. The lace trim is pointed with square eyelets.

Josefina's drawers.
Josefina (Classic and BeForever): Like Addy her drawers have a front v-panel and elastic back. However, unlike anyone else, her drawers have no lace trim at the edge and are simply hemmed. They are also a little more flared that the others.

Caroline's drawers. (And socks, cause this is from the site.)
Caroline: Elastic edge waist. no panel, and the hem edge is tucked a little above the hem trims. The trim is fine dot and scalloped eyelet trim, and slightly long. From what I've seen her pantalettes are a little longer, as they peek out under the skirt a lot more than the others, as was the style of the time.

Felicity Shift, First Edition.
Felicity and Elizabeth: First of all, I'm getting this out of the way: Felicity doesn't have panties, bloomers, drawers, or any underpants. I will go in detail when we do the Felicity meet outfit review, Version A. But back then no one wore underpants. No one. Men, women, boys and girls alike all wore shifts. Men stuffed them into breeches, women wore their dresses over them, and the girls liked a healthy breeze around their privates, thanks.5 If you see someone putting drawers on Felicity because she would want them for "modesty" they are historically inaccurate idiots and you can run tell dat.

Felicity not only has two meet outfits, she has two styles of shifts. The first one, PC Style, has an elastic neckline, double tucked short sleeves, and an untrimmed hem that comes to the knees. Mine is rumpled because Felicity nearly never takes off her stays unless Elizabeth is loosening them for her. There is no velcro and the shift pulls over her head. 

Felicity Shift, Mattel Style.
When Felicity set a precedent of going into the AG Vault and then coming back out, she came with a slimmed down shift, Mattel Style. The neckline is tucked and gathered, the sleeves are single edge, and the back closes with velcro. This is one of the few times I prefer PC over Mattel, as I can tug and pull on the elastic one to my heart's content. This is also the style that Elizabeth from AG wears. Mine has a custom made elastic style shift.

Kaya's Underwear. And sleep wear. And swim wear.
Kaya: Kaya's underwear situation can be summed up with an Avenue Q song6:
I'm not wearing underwear today!
No, I'm not wearing underwear today!
Not that you probably care,
Much about my underwear,
Still none the less I gotta say--
That I'm not wearing underwear today~!
Kaya wears no panties, briefs, bloomers, drawers, pantloons, pantalettes or shifts. Her underwear is absolutely nothing. Her sleep wear was her birthday suit. Her swimsuit was skinny dipping. Kaya would have not given a single solitary fuck that she was ass out nekkid under her dress. So no, she's not going to be wearing anything for modesty. My Kaya wears undies for moddie stuff, but in her historical wear? Naked as a jaybird. And now you know why I went in reverse historical order. Because naked dolly butt. 

As they say with bad jokes: That's the end. In this case, the end is Kaya's.


1 Psst. Pssst. Go join. I even put the link in my side bar.
2 1913. So post-Rebecca but pre-Kit. Bleach was around before that, mind, but most people didn't use it outside of industry use until about the 1930s.
3 More on Laylie and Life of Faith later.
4 Speaking of Samantha, if you haven't heard the news, she's coming back this fall, along with other changes for the Historicals. AG Archival is the equivalent of the Disney Vault, people. Was that a phone ringing? Cause I fucking called it.
5 Oh Archie. You are one of the best in passing HP characters ever.
6 No shit? It played while I was writing this post up.


  1. HEY Neth!

    That's my favorite Avenue Q song. Way to go. My Kaya's wearing moddie stuff right now, as you know, but I'm trying to scrape up a meet outfit for the Josefina I just bought, in pieces because of lack of $$$$$, bit by bit so it's really really nice to know whose underwear are whose. Interestingly enough, right before I read this post, I was doing Spanish homework, and the word for underwear was one of the vocab words. I suppose it's an underwear kind of day.

    I'm tempted to try to get Josefina's books in Spanish, just to see if I know enough Spanish to translate them at all.

  2. Thank you for doing this post! It's very helpful!

  3. BLESS THIS POST. I quite needed it. I giggled at your Felicity thing and the modesty comment, because I've known colonial people didn't wear underwear since I was in third or fourth grade (maybe even second). Also giggled at Kaya, because naked dolly butt is funny for some reason.

  4. It´s great to have a complete overview on the AG underwear. Thanks!

  5. Wado for taking the time to explain that thing. About Kaya which so many folks don't understand or ignore or fuck up. My childhood Felicity was PM, just before her retirement into the vault. I owned a Mattel Felicity and I preferred the PM shift. Much easier to adjust as needed under her dresses.

  6. I'm restoring a jacked up (sigh...some people's children) Josephina to her former glory and I purchased her meet dress on eBay.. and then realized: "oh crap! What underwear is she supposed to have?" Tada! Your post about historical undies appears within five minutes of me asking myself that. This is a great reference guide. Woohoo! Thanks!!

  7. First off: yay! Thank you so much for this post!

    I wonder why everyone always goes on about Samantha, Kit, and Molly having the same underwear--Samantha's underwear is very different from Kit's--is this a difference between PC and AG? If so, I'm actually a little disappointed--I love Samantha's underwear in this post and would love to have the opportunity to pick up a few extra pair this fall.

    I'm looking forward to reading your views on the Life of Faith collection.

    You should also make an announcement about the opening of AGCollectors over on AG>18--I'm sure there's at least one or two people who would be interested in joining.

  8. Thanks for info !!!!! You're good at this !!!!!

  9. This is such a useful post, thank you! I remember when I got my childhood dolls back out when I started collecting, and no one was wearing the right underwear, so this would have been very handy then.

  10. Another informative review....good to have for reference whenever any "underwear issues" come up.

    And you saved the best for last! Good job--no ifs, ands or buts...no, wait, one butt, and it's Kaya's, and therefore it's awesome.

  11. Archie, oh Archie. When I read Goblet of Fire (for something like the fourth or fith time) I can't help but laugh out loud when I saw that. That's part of what makes Harry Potter so interesting.(This is coming from a major Harry Potter geek)

  12. After reading this post, I realized my Marie-Grace came with Cecile's pantaloons. Hmmmm. She is an early one with fuller pin curls. I wonder why that is?

    1. They may have changed her pants, or switched them around after the first release.

  13. I eagerly anticipate more history of the underwear in review posts. That one paragraph about split drawers is quite the tease! Kaya's nightgown sounds like the most comfortable of the lot. I'll can't wait to get a Kaya so we can dress to match.

  14. I've probably mentioned this before, but my Felicity rolls commando under her meet dress because it won't Velcro properly with her shift on. Never has. Don't know what the deal was with Pleasant Company clothing.

  15. I thought of you and this post yesterday while browsing old AG catalogs. It was the Holiday Wishbook for 2012, and there was Kaya, in her tepee, sweetly tucked in under her furs--wearing her dress, which I understand from your history lessons is a thing no self-respecting Nimiipuu girl would ever do. I don't know what was up with that...probably the photographer just didn't know...or else they were thinking that a naked dolly wouldn't be fit for the eyes of young children? (This, even though some of the little darlings, when they get their dollies home, keep them in that state on a semi-permanent basis!)

    Oh, well, it's no skin off me, or muslin or vinyl either. Just thought the rest of you might find it amusing, as I did....

  16. I read this a while back and somehow found it again tonight, after buying a great classic Addy from Craigslist who came with two pairs of bloomers. One is hers for sure based on the above and the other is Josefina's pantalettes. Thanks for some terrific articles!


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